Via Rasmussen: Rasmussen Reports™: The Most Comprehensive Public Opinion Data Anywhere
Only 53% of American adults believe capitalism is better than socialism.The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey found that 20% disagree and say socialism is better. Twenty-seven percent (27%) are not sure which is better.
The exact text of the question is not in the press release and I could not find a link to the actual poll in the story. The write-up does note:
The question posed by Rasmussen Reports did not define either capitalism or socialism
Given that it is manifestly clear from recent political rhetoric that people in general have no idea what an appropriate definition of either of these terms is, it is impossible to ably interpret these results. Further, if we assume that part of the question did include the issue of which is “better” we would have to know what that meant to the respondents as well. “Better” at doing what?
As such this is, as my headline suggests, a worthless set of results.
Nonetheless, some are drawing conclusions anyway.
For example,1 Gateway pundit writes:
Rejoice comrades!Congratulations to the liberal media, Hollywood, our fine liberal educational institutions, Democrats, and Commie lovers everywhere!
The statement is accompanied by a graphic featuring Marx, Lenin, Stalin and Obama.
Of course, such a statement (and graphic) underscores what I mean regarding the poll and the definition of “socialism.” Without even getting into the issue (for the moment) of the correctness of Gateway Pundit’s definition, it is clear that he has a very specific one in which he understands “socialism” to mean “Soviet style communism.” What this illustrates in terms of poll interpretation is that when one looks at poll results unless one has a clear sense of how the respondents understand the terms being used (which is difficult to ascertain, to be sure), then one cannot really know what the poll is telling us.
We do not know what “socialism” (or, for that matter, “capitalism”) means to the respondents in the Rasmussen poll. No doubt some thought it meant what Gateway Pundit meant. It may conjure Sweden or Europe in general to other respondents. Or, because the GOP tried to peg Obama as a “socialist” it is possible that some respondents think that “socialism” simply means a slight increase on the top marginal tax rate.
The bottom line is: since the poll question used complex terms that have multiple meanings, the poll itself tells us almost nothing (it probably tells us that as words, “capitalism” is roughly twice as popular as “socialism” in the general population, but not much else–and even that finding is dubious).
I would hypothesize, by the way, if the poll question was: “Which is better, capitalism or Soviet style communism” that the results would have been radically different in favor of capitalism.
Wording matters in poll questions.
Which, gets me back to Gateway Pundit’s definition of “socialism”–it is, in fact, incorrect. There is a lot more to socialism than simply the USSR. Heck, the existence of universal education in the US is a socialistic practice, as are any number of other elements of US public policy. This is, as I have noted before, a far more complicated discussion that many seem willing to admit.
Sphere: Related Content- Another example of over-reaction to the poll can be found at Sister Toldja:
It is not a coincidence that the radicals of the late 1960s were entering the decision-level positions of the education establishment 30 years ago.
[↩]
April 9th, 2009 at 11:28 am
the existence of universal education in the US is a socialistic practice
Oh, I don’t know about that. One might call early promoters like Horace Mann a type of “socialist.” But public education as we know it in the US was primarily shaped by ubercapitalists like Rockefeller and Carnegie, who were driven as much by economic interest as concern for the common weal.
April 9th, 2009 at 11:34 am
It really doesn’t matter who supported it or why, it is a clear example of private costs and benefits being socialized, i.e., the education of every child in the US from K-12 is a shared cost by every tax-paying citizen, whether a parent or not and the benefit is universal. I am not sure what you would call that apart from “socialism” in the most general sense of the term.
For that matter: does the aim of the policy make it “socialistic” or does the actual policy mechanism underlying it? In other words: even if we assume that there are capitalistic motivations for the policy, does it make it any less of a shared, social cost with a shared, social benefit?
Of course, you make my point about the poll by disputing my application of the term: there is no shared, easily identified definition of the term that could be adequately captured by the poll cited.
BTW, universal public education was one of the list of demands in the Communist Manifesto.
April 9th, 2009 at 12:21 pm
Right. As it was one of Thomas Jefferson’s in Notes on Virginia.
there is no shared, easily identified definition
I don’t think so. The problem is that there are many shared, identifiable definitions. “Socialistic” is a lot like “politics” in that it has many shared meanings: a broad meaning (”the affairs of the polis”), polemical meaning (”just politics”), a definitional meaning(s) (”electoral competition”), etc.
I wasn’t aiming to defend the poll - it’s really dumb. I’m just saying that US public schools weren’t and arguably still aren’t “socialistic” in the utopian, Owenist sense. They were designed as a means to a quite unsocialist end (thus opening another can of Socialist worms).
April 9th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
Fair enough, although your point continues to make my most basic point: it all depends on what one means by “socialist.”
April 9th, 2009 at 12:50 pm
[...] Steven Taylor says the poll results are “worthless“: The exact text of the question is not in the press release and I could not find a link to [...]
April 9th, 2009 at 12:53 pm
Just to add to the list, John Stuart Mill also indirectly advocated public education in Utilitarianism:
April 9th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
Hmmm. Not so sure about Mill. Here he is in On Liberty:
April 9th, 2009 at 1:24 pm
Well, I did note it was indirect (and one can hardly contest his “moulding people to be exactly like one another” critique). However, when you consider both propositions together:
1. Mill claims that “mental culture” is the birthright of “everyone born in a civilized country”
2. Mill clearly acknowledges that not everyone in a society has the same economic means of support
It doesn’t seem to follow that he’s advocating only for private education, which not “everyone” will be able to afford. Remember that for utilitarian purposes, only the results and consequences matter. If only a minority can afford such education, this tends to limit the distribution of utility rather than maximize it. We should also consider that Utilitarianism was written 4 years after On Liberty (according to Wiki anyway), perhaps the discrepancy reflects a later evolution of his thoughts.
April 9th, 2009 at 1:26 pm
Oh, brother.
April 9th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
I think Mill would say (but I’m probably just projecting my own views) there’s a difference between the idea of universal education and it’s myriad uses to government.
April 9th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
In re: “Oh, brother” let me say: indeed/yeesh. I love the guy’s comparison of thinks like the relative sales figure for Atlas Shrugged v. Capital–because Goodness knows that a massive philosophical/economic tome should sell at the same rate as a novel…
April 9th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
Andy:
True enough; the two quotes of his we’ve cited don’t directly contradict each other. Looked at from my perspective, they represent justifiable criticism of “what is,” followed by a normative view of “what should be.”
April 10th, 2009 at 3:07 am
[...] Konsider Karl. Or Konservative “Tea Parties.” Or the hue and cry over a poll that Polyblog saved me the trouble of blogging: Thursday, April 9, 2009 Latest Worthless Poll Numbers By Dr. Steven [...]
April 10th, 2009 at 7:02 am
[...] poll questions this time, but rather odd pronouncements from US Representative Spencer Bachus [...]
April 10th, 2009 at 9:31 pm
[...] Dr. Steven Taylor at PoliBlog thinks we should ignore the whole thing: “Given that it is manifestly clear from recent political rhetoric that people in general have [...]